Bernie Barlow: On Songwriting, Singing, and the Journey of an Artist
Singer-songwriter Bernie Barlow discusses her latest album, Walking Around This Town, the craft of writing and performing music, and what it means to pursue artistry at this stage of her career. With decades of experience as both a lead vocalist and sought-after backing singer, Barlow shares intimate insights into her creative process, collaborative relationships, and the evolving landscape of the music industry.
Transcript
The Craft of Songwriting
Cris Cohen: One of the songs that jumped out at me from this album was “Which Way To Go.” It’s one of those songs where you feel like you know it, even though it’s the first time hearing it. I was playing it in the car and my wife started singing along immediately. How does one accomplish that trick?
Bernie Barlow: I think you get lucky. But you also keep showing up… writing, singing, making creative noises. There are two great co-writers on that song (Dave Darling and Paul Lindemulder), and the three of us know each other intimately. We have a shorthand.
Paul and I are similar ages and we’ve worked in different musical situations together over the years. We’ve witnessed each other’s lives… divorces, major life changes. I kept telling the guys what themes I wanted to explore on the record, and with that in mind, you sit down and start singing a great little melody. It’s not that hard when you have that foundation.
But I don’t think I would have written that song 30 years ago. I would now, because I’ve lived. I understand life and how it unravels more deeply. You’re not going to get that if you don’t put the time in.
The Value of Experience
Cris Cohen: That brings up one of my pet peeves with the music business. There are many artists who became famous when they were young, and I contend they’re releasing some of their best work now, but it’s not getting the attention it deserves because they’re older and it’s not in their “classic hits” phase.
Bernie Barlow: Exactly. Sometimes you want to sing about things that are more emotionally resonant to your life. Look at Bonnie Raitt. She really blew up in her fifties, didn’t she? She’d been out there playing and singing, coming from this great musical lineage. She hit a sweet spot in her fifties, and I still love her work.
Sometimes you need to have really felt emotion in order to emote to people while you’re singing. I’m a better singer than I was 25 years ago because I’m a mom. I had this huge experience of making a human being and watching them grow. That changes everything.
Cris Cohen: It shifts your perspective because you’re seeing the world through your child’s eyes part of the time.
Bernie Barlow: Absolutely. I’m a much better person for it. I grew a lot. I learned to be happier when it’s not about me.
The Art of Backing Vocals
Cris Cohen: What’s the key to backing yourself?
Bernie Barlow: It’s a different part of my brain. When you’re singing backgrounds, you’re the slave of the song. You’re there to enhance the song or the vocal, not to sing the message. A lead vocal and a backing vocal are very different, and I love both.
When you’re singing backgrounds, it’s more like an instrument than a voice. I don’t even think about it consciously. It’s just musical. My favorite thing is to multitrack my own voice. It really likes itself. Not all voices like themselves multitracked, but mine does. It does create a certain sound.
Working with Producers
Cris Cohen: I would think that’s the point of having a producer, to have someone with a different perspective who can say, “I think it sounds better this way.”
Bernie Barlow: Exactly. Though sometimes if I really hear something or want to create a specific sound, I’ll communicate that wholeheartedly. Sometimes he’ll agree with me.
I’m lucky with my producer (Dave Darling), and I trust him. That’s crucial. As a young singer doing a lot of backgrounds, I learned to read what people were trying to get me to do from the other side of the glass before they’d even tell me. Sometimes they’d try to manipulate you. You can’t do that with me. You can guide me, but I have to be in on it with you. It has to be collaborative. I don’t like being fooled.
Recording Approaches: Then and Now
Bernie Barlow: I did a lot of pop singing in my twenties, and those sessions were recorded in such a precise, rhythmic way. The approach was very different from the record I just made with Dave, where many of the vocals are one pass. There are a few where I went back to revisit, but we tracked with the band and he kept 75% of my original vocals.
I sing pretty quickly and efficiently, and I really knew the material going into the studio. But I remember singing for three or four days on one pop song in my twenties. It’s a totally different machine approach to music.
Cris Cohen: There are lots of times where they go overboard and take the humanity out of it. When you hear this album in good quality, your voice and the backing vocals sound warm, like you’re sitting there with the band in the room.
Bernie Barlow: Dave tracked us all together.
Voice as Instrument and Emotional Expression
Cris Cohen: You’ve said you don’t think of it as your voice, but as a distinct musical instrument. How much has that perspective freed you to approach lyrics or melodies differently?
Bernie Barlow: I’m very spontaneous when I’m musical, so I don’t consciously think about it that way in the moment. What I do think about when singing backgrounds is: what emotional noise do I need to convey here? If it’s a happy song, you’ll have happiness in your voice. If it’s sadness, I’ve been told I have a certain cry in my voice that people find emotional, and sometimes you can use that.
When I write, we usually find a chord progression and start with melody first. We figure out: what are we talking about here? What’s the emotional vibe coming from this melody? Then we develop the subject from there.
A Lesson from Ray Ellis and Billie Holiday
Bernie Barlow: I did a session for an Adam Sandler movie with Ray Ellis as composer. He produced Lady in Satin. I’ve had that album since I was young and knew his name. I couldn’t believe I was getting to sing for him.
He told me, “You’re not a pop singer. You’re a jazz singer.” So I asked him what it was like to record Billie Holiday.
He said he thought his career was over because she came to the studio exhausted all the time. They had this big band recording his arrangements, and he was worried. But when I listened to those vocals, they’re so painful.
It’s like acting in that sense. What that person is doing in that moment, that’s what gets captured, the emotion they’re feeling when they’re singing. She was in pain and tired, and the whole album sounds like a weak vocal recording, which actually worked in their favor.
The Writing Process: From Concept to Song
Cris Cohen: A lot of these songs sound like they’d work acoustically as well as with a full band, particularly “Enough Time,” which has this great campfire jam session vibe. Was that how these songs came to fruition?
Bernie Barlow: Pretty much every song… acoustic guitar and voice in a room. That’s how they all came to be. Dave said to write 25 songs, maybe 30. I think I got to 24.
“Enough Time” came from us talking about what was going on in our lives. Lily (Wilson) had received a phone call from a dear friend whose mother had passed away. They said they never had enough time because the doctors gave her nine months to live, but she only made it three. I said, “Lily, my mom’s 92. I still don’t feel like it’s enough time.”
We wrote from there. I told Paul and Lily there’s a celebratory approach I wanted… songs to sing at wakes or celebration of life events, because I think we should celebrate each other.
The Discipline of Songwriting
Cris Cohen: When someone gives you homework to write 25 to 30 songs, how do you approach that?
Bernie Barlow: You show up and write. What do they say? Ten percent inspiration, 90 percent perspiration. Some songs, like “Million Miles An Hour,” came out in 10 minutes. Dave and I wrote that in 10 minutes. Other songs took six or seven hours.
We generally tried to get together on Tuesdays every couple of weeks and got really disciplined about writing. I also worked with other friends and traveled to Nashville and Portland with the intention of writing.
Collaboration and Co-Writing
Cris Cohen: What do you usually bring to the table in these sessions, and what do you look for in a co-writer?
Bernie Barlow: I’m a great song editor. I contribute melody, sometimes lyrics. I had the good fortune of singing a lot of demos in my twenties for the best songwriters in Los Angeles. It was great training.
Lily’s solid… one foot in front of the other, stays on task. Paul and I tend to be all over the place… music, melody, lyrics all coming out simultaneously. Lily’s a great filter for us, like a catcher catching all the good balls.
It’s a democracy when the three of us write. Best idea wins. You never know what that might be… a melody, a vowel sound, where that vowel sound lands rhythmically.
Working with Philip Sayce
Cris Cohen: You have Philip Sayce playing really hot guitar on “Million Miles an Hour.” When collaborating in that sense, how much is just saying “here’s where I want the solo” versus discussing what you’re hoping for?
Bernie Barlow: Philip Sayce is a magical musical being. He’s very much like me. He responds to the music. Whatever the music is saying, he exaggerates it, makes it known. That man is such a genius.
I tried to get him on my last record, but he had a deal in Canada and they weren’t eager for him to appear on some indie record. Now he’s out on his own, and I had an indie label I was signed to. We waited for him. I said, “No, I want Philip on my record.” I’m on a couple of his records and I know what we do together.
I was so happy that day. You could have pulled me off the ceiling. My husband was videoing me. I couldn’t believe I was getting him on my record. He’s just the nicest person on the planet and such a talent.
Musical Education: Learning from Elvis
Cris Cohen: You’ve said that Elvis Presley taught you how to sing. Are there things you learned from immersing yourself in those albums that are still part of your skill set today?
Bernie Barlow: Much of this record is more rock-oriented. The previous record has more of a rhythm and blues flavor, which was intentional.
When I do rhythm and blues, that’s when I draw on what I learned from Elvis. I learned rhythm from him, pain, how to deliver a vocal. He’s one of the best in the world, right? I was this little kid, all my siblings were 10 years older than me. I had everybody’s record collections: my mom’s, my older siblings’.
I loved him from the movies. I thought he was so cool, and he was such a great singer. Learning his music taught me rhythm and blues.
The Reality of Being an Independent Artist
Cris Cohen: You have this interesting line where you said, “I realize it’s not often a woman singer my age gets a chance to keep doing this.” How much does that thought contribute to joy in making an album, and how much does it contribute to pressure?
Bernie Barlow: All of the above. Even now I’m asking myself: am I going to make another record? Where’s my focus going to be? Time is precious. Should I be selling up and traveling around the world and enjoying myself? Or should I still be making music for people? These are questions in my life every day.
The older you get, the less your phone rings for work. I just did a little tour on the East Coast, and those people loved us. They love the music and want us back in the summer. When you get a standing ovation or an audible “wow” at the end of a song you’ve written, it’s different from being the background singer on stage in front of 50,000 people. It’s like, “Oh wow, they really like what I wrote.” That’s pretty cool.
And it’s so much work, Cris. I don’t have a manager, so I’m wearing all the hats. We’re making our own videos, my husband and I. I’m doing all my social media, probably poorly. I’m doing my best… setting up tours, hiring musicians. It’s a lot for one person. I’ve probably never worked so hard in my life.
Looking Forward
Bernie Barlow: I think the future of music is in live performance. I feel very fortunate that I can still sing live. Many women my age can’t at this point in their careers. I feel fortunate that I met Kirk (Pasich of Blue Élan Records) and that he gave me a record deal.
Right now I’m trying to figure out how to get gigs and play music for people live. It’s incredibly hard and incredibly expensive. I think I’m going to concentrate on the West Coast and doing more live performances that I can record and share online so people can see and hear who I am.
Bernie Barlow’s website: https://www.berniebarlow.com/
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